I think that Countdown to Christmas only partially qualifies as a series. In most ways it is a series. But the network doesn't list or number the movies as sequential episodes like they would a series. So it falls short.
btw, I love Hallmark Channel's Countdown to Christmas. It's one of the things I look forward to at this time of year. :)
dpratt wrote:
I think that Countdown to Christmas only partially qualifies as a series. In most ways it is a series. But the network doesn't list or number the movies as sequential episodes like they would a series. So it falls short.
btw, I love Hallmark Channel's Countdown to Christmas. It's one of the things I look forward to at this time of year. :)
So does my Wife and I do somewhat. I'm not sure why they start so early I wish they waited to Thanksgiving Day before they start airing there around the clock Christmas Movies and that's when I'm finally in the mood and start watching them myself. My Wife started this year the day the first one began and hasn't taken it off of Hallmark Channel since them. I'm just glad she has her own Computer room with a widescreen in it so I don't have to start watching myself yet. I love Football College & Pro so I'm still in that mood and WOW what a 7th Game of the World Series, Way To Go CUBBIES! I'm a Yankees Fan at Heart and Hate the Red Sox & Indians so I rooted for the Bigger Underdog.
I don't mind them starting early but I think they could have at least waited till November. October is too early to start with the Christmas movies.
Sorry to bring this up again, but I was thinking we really should add Count Down To Christmas to the database. It really is a series, and TVmaze would help people keep track of which movies they've already watched, especially since they don't need to be watched in order.
I know I wasn't 100% for it at first, but I realized that even though it's kind of unique in that it's all movies and not episodes, it's still a series in all other ways.
Just thought I would voice my opinion on it. In case it helps.
If it gets approved. I recommend we use Year instead of Season number like talk and news shows do.
Or maybe support should simply be added for made-for-TV movies, since TV movies are such a common thing, and is well within the scope of TV after all.
dpratt wrote:
Or maybe support should simply be added for made-for-TV movies, since TV movies are such a common thing, and is well within the scope of TV after all.
If we start to allow tv-movies we open Pandora's Box, I think this cannot be handled right now :)
Like I said, just expressing my two cents as I think it's well within the scope of TV to include them. I understand that much consideration should be taken first though.
dpratt wrote:
Sorry to bring this up again, but I was thinking we really should add Count Down To Christmas to the database. It really is a series, and TVmaze would help people keep track of which movies they've already watched, especially since they don't need to be watched in order.
I know I wasn't 100% for it at first, but I realized that even though it's kind of unique in that it's all movies and not episodes, it's still a series in all other ways.
Just thought I would voice my opinion on it. In case it helps.
If it gets approved. I recommend we use Year instead of Season number like talk and news shows do.
In what ways is it a series? Does it have a regular cast? Does it have a regular production crew? Does it have a consistent plotline between all of the movies? Those would be at least three of the ways that would make it a series.
It might have a regular production crew. I'm not sure. Probably though seeing as they pump out dozens of original tv movies every year.
And yes they reuse many of the same cast members every year. It can get confusing since the plots are also recycled. :P All the more reason to add them to the database so that users can keep track of them more easily.
Not sure they should be added as a series though. It might be better to just add support for TV movies. But it's definitely worth considering imo.
Does it have a consistent plotline between all of the movies? - That is a BIG YES! - Romance & Love at Christmas how it unfolds and how it has a very happy ending sometimes leading to marriage.
Some same cast members are used over and over again between movies here are just a few for example:
Alicia Witt - Christmas List, I'm Not Ready For Christmas, Christmas at Cartwright's, A Snow Globe Christmas, A Very Merry Mix-Up
Bailee Madison - Holiday Joy, Northpole: Open for Christmas, Northpole, Pete's Christmas
Candace Cameron Bure - Journey Back to Christmas, A Christmas Detour, Christmas Under Wraps, Let It Snow, The Heart of Christmas, Moonlight & Mistletoe
Danika McKellar - My Christmas Dream, Crown for Christmas, Love at the Christmas Table
Dean Cain - Broadcasting Christmas, Beverly Hills Christmas, Merry X-Mas, A Belle for Christmas, Small Town Santa, Defending Santa, The Dog who saved the Holidays, The Case for Christmas, The Dog who saved Christmas Vacation, A Nanny for Christmas
Jaime King - The Mistletoe Promise, Silent Night
Kristin Davis - A Heavenly Christmas, Deck the Halls
Rachel Boston - A Rose for Christmas, Ice Sculpture Christmas
NOTE: I have seen every one of these Movies in the last 3 or 4 years some more than once.
Do the actors play the same characters in each movie? Recycling actors is pretty common. For instance, Alicia Witt has played Holly Nolan, Isobel Gray, Nicky Talbot, Meg, and Alice Chapman. Unless she regenerates like the Doctor in Doctor Who, that doesn't sound like the same character. And even then, the Doctor doesn't change his name each time.
Plus all of them having the same individual title is another consistent way that is used to determine if something ia a series, even if it's an anthology (i.e., The Twilight Zone). Citing a bunch of different titles doesn't seem like a way to show that it is one series.
A consistent theme is not the same as a consistent plotline. Or single story, if you prefer. Again, do the movies have a consistent plotline among them? Does one movie lead to the next story-wise (i.e., Sharknado).
For instance, Sharknado has consistent characters from one to the other (Ian Ziering as Fin, Tara Reid as April, Cody LInley, David Hasselhoff). Each one is tied to the previous one(s). All were written by Thunder Levin. They all have Sharknado in the individual titles. Twilight Zone has a common narrator, a common title for all of the episodes, and pretty much the same producers in any given season.
Do the "Countdown for Christmas" movies share the same qualities? If so, it would seem to be a series. If not, what makes it a series other than theme? And if theme is the determination, every horror movie shown during Halloween would be part of the same series.
You could claim that "Countdown to Christmas" is an anthology, but it seems to lack many of the things that make up TV show anthologies like The Twilight Zone, Tales From the Crypt, Tales from the Darkside, etc.
At the end of the day, TV movies are movies that air on TV. The fact that a network gives them a blanket theme title doesn't make them a TV show. Arguing to expand the definition of movie/series might mean that the definition becomes so broad that TV movies get dropped entirely from TVMaze.
It doesn't have a common narrator, but it does have a common hostess. This winter Candace Cameron Bure hosted. I'm not talking about starring in the movies, although she did that too in some of them. I mean that at the beginning and at the end of the movie and when the show goes to commercial, she jumps in with a quick comment. Does that make it a anthology? Maybe sorta kinda. However since the network blocks out the time as the name of the movie, and not "Countdown to Christmas" I think Hallmark Channel still views it as a movie more than a series. Yet during commercials and after the movie finishes, they will promote the next brand new "Countdown to Christmas" episode so it's a gray area.
An easy solution would be just allow made for TV movies. Then we could stop this debate right now.
dpratt wrote:
It doesn't have a common narrator, but it does have a common hostess. This winter Candace Cameron Bure hosted. I'm not talking about starring in the movies, although she did that too in some of them. I mean that at the beginning and at the end of the movie and when the show goes to commercial, she jumps in with a quick comment. Does that make it a anthology? Maybe sorta kinda. However since the network blocks out the time as the name of the movie, and not "Countdown to Christmas" I think Hallmark Channel still views it as a movie more than a series. Yet during commercials and after the movie finishes, they will promote the next brand new "Countdown to Christmas" episode so it's a gray area.
An easy solution would be just allow made for TV movies. Then we could stop this debate right now.
Yes you are correct however that will never happen as the owners of the site don't want to have anything to do with Made for TV Movies and what they say goes!
dpratt wrote:
It doesn't have a common narrator, but it does have a common hostess. This winter Candace Cameron Bure hosted. I'm not talking about starring in the movies, although she did that too in some of them. I mean that at the beginning and at the end of the movie and when the show goes to commercial, she jumps in with a quick comment. Does that make it a anthology? Maybe sorta kinda. However since the network blocks out the time as the name of the movie, and not "Countdown to Christmas" I think Hallmark Channel still views it as a movie more than a series. Yet during commercials and after the movie finishes, they will promote the next brand new "Countdown to Christmas" episode so it's a gray area.
An easy solution would be just allow made for TV movies. Then we could stop this debate right now.
"hostess" is fine. The Cryptkeeper doesn't narrate Tales From the Crypt, Rod Serling didn't narrate (most of) The Twilight Zone. They just popped in at the beginning and end. I'd consider them "hosts," and hosts are an acceptable part of TV show anthologies.
However, was her hosting part of the movie, or part of the network promotion? If the show goes to commercial and she makes a comment in the commercial break (even if it's not a commercial), then it sounds like she's not part of the movie.
Overall, it sounds like they're movies. TV movies, but movies. People here are calling them movies, IMDB (which is considered a valid source) calls them movies. Futoncritic cites press releases which call them "original holiday movies." Which means Hallmark calls them movies, since FC is quoting them. An easy solution which has already been implemented is saying that TVMaze is about shows, not movies, and won't list standalone TV movies. It doesn't seem to have stopped the debate, so I doubt doing the same thing in the opposite direction would end the debate, either.
If folks are going to argue that TVMaze shows some movies and thus that's encouraging more debate... an easy solution would be to get rid of all movies already on the site. That's why I'd be leery of asking for more movies to be added: it might have the opposite effect.
Yes you are correct that she pops in during the commercial breaks, not during the show.
Thanks for your post. Just to be clear, my position is that all made-for-TV movies should be added to the site, upon the approval of the TVmaze admins of course. I'm not talking about movies that were released in theaters first, or at film festivals. I'm talking about movies that went straight to television: Lifetime original movies, Hallmark original movies, etc. Probably not straight to video though, like Netflix or Amazon original movies, since those are arguably not straight to TV.
Someone said this would be Pandora's Box. I assume that means there would be way too many entries on this site which would need verifying and editing. And therefore it's simply too much work. I'm not sure I agree with that, but I do understand that keeping a site like this going involves an incredible amount of dedication. There is a lot of work put into this site, verifying information is accurate. I understand that it might need a doubling of efforts to try and maintain this site.
dpratt wrote:
Yes you are correct that she pops in during the commercial breaks, not during the show.
Thanks for your post. Just to be clear, my position is that all made-for-TV movies should be added to the site, upon the approval of the TVmaze admins of course. I'm not talking about movies that were released in theaters first, or at film festivals. I'm talking about movies that went straight to television: Lifetime original movies, Hallmark original movies, etc. Probably not straight to video though, like Netflix or Amazon original movies, since those are arguably not straight to TV.
Someone said this would be Pandora's Box. I assume that means there would be way too many entries on this site which would need verifying and editing. And therefore it's simply too much work. I'm not sure I agree with that, but I do understand that keeping a site like this going involves an incredible amount of dedication. There is a lot of work put into this site, verifying information is accurate. I understand that it might need a doubling of efforts to try and maintain this site.
It's been mentioned tons of times before by the site admin the reason we don't allow these movies is that the current system we have in place, ie Stars, Guest Stars, Crew etc can't be applied to a TV movie in the same way it's applied to a TV series. This is the only reason that they aren't allowed. However series of one-off TV movies are allowed as Gadfly has stated. For example http://www.tvmaze.com/shows/9983/professor-branestawm
Some of the examples JDOG mentions suggests that some of the films within the programming strand have included series of tv films for example
"Northpole: Open for Christmas, Northpole"
"The Dog who saved the Holidays, The Dog who saved Christmas Vacation"
If these are running in the same way as 'Sharknado' as a series then there's no reason that they can't be added to the site as there own guides. In the same way that we have the Dolly Parton seasonal movies added too:
http://www.tvmaze.com/shows/17091/dolly-partons-co...
Continuing this conversation however isn't going to go much further as it stands, there's lots of things everybody wants to be added and included and both Jan and David are aware of what they are and how or what they want to be in place before we add them to the site, if those options are ever available.
TomSouthwell wrote:
It's been mentioned tons of times before by the site admin the reason we don't allow these movies is that the current system we have in place, ie Stars, Guest Stars, Crew etc can't be applied to a TV movie in the same way it's applied to a TV series. This is the only reason that they aren't allowed. However series of one-off TV movies are allowed as Gadfly has stated. For example http://www.tvmaze.com/shows/9983/professor-branestawm
Some of the examples JDOG mentions suggests that some of the films within the programming strand have included series of tv films for example
"Northpole: Open for Christmas, Northpole"
"The Dog who saved the Holidays, The Dog who saved Christmas Vacation"
If these are running in the same way as 'Sharknado' as a series then there's no reason that they can't be added to the site as there own guides. In the same way that we have the Dolly Parton seasonal movies added too:
http://www.tvmaze.com/shows/17091/dolly-partons-co...
Continuing this conversation however isn't going to go much further as it stands, there's lots of things everybody wants to be added and included and both Jan and David are aware of what they are and how or what they want to be in place before we add them to the site, if those options are ever available.
Northpole & Northpole: Open for Christmas are here as I had them/it added. The other 2 Movies you mentioned need to be researched to see if they are in fact connected in someway other than the closeness of their titles?
TomSouthwell wrote:
It's been mentioned tons of times before by the site admin the reason we don't allow these movies is that the current system we have in place, ie Stars, Guest Stars, Crew etc can't be applied to a TV movie in the same way it's applied to a TV series. This is the only reason that they aren't allowed. However series of one-off TV movies are allowed as Gadfly has stated. For example http://www.tvmaze.com/shows/9983/professor-branestawm
Some of the examples JDOG mentions suggests that some of the films within the programming strand have included series of tv films for example
"Northpole: Open for Christmas, Northpole"
"The Dog who saved the Holidays, The Dog who saved Christmas Vacation"
If these are running in the same way as 'Sharknado' as a series then there's no reason that they can't be added to the site as there own guides. In the same way that we have the Dolly Parton seasonal movies added too:
http://www.tvmaze.com/shows/17091/dolly-partons-co...
Continuing this conversation however isn't going to go much further as it stands, there's lots of things everybody wants to be added and included and both Jan and David are aware of what they are and how or what they want to be in place before we add them to the site, if those options are ever available.
This is correct :)
JAGUARDOG wrote:
Northpole & Northpole: Open for Christmas are here as I had them/it added. The other 2 Movies you mentioned need to be researched to see if they are in fact connected in someway other than the closeness of their titles?
Regarding the Dog movies. Yes they share the same primary cast, same dog, same voice actor, etc. It's definitely a sequel.
