Extra crew types

Is there a way for contributors to add crew types?
If not, the following should be added:


Producer
Production Manager
Set Decorator
Sound


Thanks!

Hello Gadfly and welcome over here, joined today did you? What happened to Rage did they go Bankrupt or were they just shut down permanently?

To answer your question above only 1 member of the STAFF named David can add Crew types I think unless Jan can as well? I have already requested Producer as well as Director, Writer and Author but in a different thread? He will only add Director & Writer at Episode level so you must have an episode with a full date (Year-Month-Day) or it is a no go the system does not allow an episode with only a year or only a year and month. Do you have my email so we can talk further old friend?

Is there a way for contributors to add crew types?
If not, the following should be added:

Producer
Production Manager
Set Decorator
Sound
Unit Production Manager
Visual Effects Producer
Production Designer
Script Coordinator
Re-Recording Mixer

I've added all of these, including 'Based on the Novel Of', to the code. They'll appear on the site late this night.

I haven't added the region-specific casting entries yet. It seems a bit overkill to me to add such a credit for each possible city in the world where casting takes place; would the regular "Casting" credit perhaps not suffice?

I've added all of these, including 'Based on the Novel Of', to the code. They'll appear on the site late this night.
I haven't added the region-specific casting entries yet. It seems a bit overkill to me to add such a credit for each possible city in the world where casting takes place; would the regular "Casting" credit perhaps not suffice?

I agree with you 100% David we should only have Casting, Casting Assistant, Casting Director and a few others I can't remember right now that have Casting in them.

I haven't added the region-specific casting entries yet. It seems a bit overkill to me to add such a credit for each possible city in the world where casting takes place; would the regular "Casting" credit perhaps not suffice?

The only concern here IMO is that sometimes a show will list multiple casting types. Smallville, for instance, has both Los Angeles Casting and Vancouver Casting. Under the Dome has Casting and North Carolina Casting.

I'd agree that it's overkill. But then again, it's an overkill that a single show will often use.

I haven't added the region-specific casting entries yet. It seems a bit overkill to me to add such a credit for each possible city in the world where casting takes place; would the regular "Casting" credit perhaps not suffice?

The only concern here IMO is that sometimes a show will list multiple casting types. Smallville, for instance, has both Los Angeles Casting and Vancouver Casting. Under the Dome has Casting and North Carolina Casting.
I'd agree that it's overkill. But then again, it's an overkill that a single show will often use.

I still think trying to separate Casting by a location, City, State, Country you name it is OVERKILL to the MAX and a huge waste of time trying to add when there is so many more important things that need to be added to the site Shows, Episodes, Summaries, Photos, Cast, Crew and Important Crew types that most people care about. Maybe in 5 or so years if the site continues to stay active and most of those more Important things have been added into the site by then (yeah, sure more like 10 years or more) then obscure things like that can be added in at that time?

David, can you please add Crew Type "Script Writer" to the site.

Kevin Williamson will write the script and will executive produce "Time After Time" through his Outerbanks Entertainment and WBTV.

Someone who writes a script for TV is pretty much always credited as Writer. Or Story, or Teleplay. And those are the credits that ABC uses. What does Williamson's on-screen credit show him as, for the show in question?

If the show hasn't aired yet, maybe TVMaze should wait until it airs to see how he's credited?

When he wrote the script for the first few episodes of The Following, Williamson was just credited as Writer. Although there were some movie reporters who described him as a script writer. Which is a common movie term, but not so much in TV.

Someone who writes a script for TV is pretty much always credited as Writer. Or Story, or Teleplay. And those are the credits that ABC uses. What does Williamson's on-screen credit show him as, for the show in question?
If the show hasn't aired yet, maybe TVMaze should wait until it airs to see how he's credited?

When he wrote the script for the first few episodes of The Following, Williamson was just credited as Writer.

I second that, exactly my opinion too :)

cheers
Juan

Someone who writes a script for TV is pretty much always credited as Writer. Or Story, or Teleplay. And those are the credits that ABC uses. What does Williamson's on-screen credit show him as, for the show in question?
If the show hasn't aired yet, maybe TVMaze should wait until it airs to see how he's credited?

When he wrote the script for the first few episodes of The Following, Williamson was just credited as Writer. Although there were some movie reporters who described him as a script writer. Which is a common movie term, but not so much in TV.

If the show hasn't aired yet, maybe TVMaze should wait until it airs to see how he's credited? - DUH, how he is credited, it was spelled out in the release how he is credited - he will write the script - that means he is a scriptwriter isn't it obvious GAD?What he has done or been in the past is irrelevant to what he will be doing now so why do you want to complicate it? If for some reason his title needs to be changed at a later date then so be it

If for some reason his title needs to be changed at a later date then so be it

Well... no?

Based on my experience with databases, and what I've seen of TVMaze, here's what'll happen:

Someone will have to watch the episode and check all of the credits. And then correct it. It's a pain in the ass to replace crew types when you're trying to watch a premiere episode, add real cast and legitimate crew types, and so on. But that's the relatively easy part.

Since "Script Writer" hasn't existed as a credit in pretty much any American show in 40+ years, it will then have to be removed from the system. That means whoever checks the credits will have to contact David or whoever else on staff handles that kind of thing and have them remove it. Unless David remembers this conversation 3+ months later, the contactor will either have to type an explanation, or dig back and find this post, and direct David to it. And give a brief explanation.

But in those 3+ months, most likely someone else--perhaps yourself--will assign Script Writer to other people. Because they'll think, "Hey, if it's in the database, it must be a legitimate crew type." Even though it isn't and never was.

Since Script Writer is a Crew Appearance, and Writer is Guest Crew, it won't be a matter of simply changing Script Writer. Assuming that can be done, and nobody complains when it happens: add more response time if they do. Someone will have to go through and look for all of the occurrences of Script Writer, delete it from Crew Appearances, and add it under Guest Crew. I doubt that a system currently exists to find out every time that a Crew type is used on all shows, much less make the replacement. So it'll have to be done manually.

Most likely, TVMaze staff won't bother because this is all adding up to be a major hassle. So that incorrect crew entry will just sit there, and more people will use it over the years, until TVMaze has a well-established but totally false crew type. And people trying to add crew and typing S, or S-C, or S-C-R from the pull-down will have to see why it went to Script Writer instead of what they intended. All because Nellie Andreeva at Deadline.com decide to pad her article by three words. :)

Just as a note, I'm all for David or whoever vetting crew type additions. One issue at TVRage was the fact that anybody could add any crew type, anytime that they wanted. This led to at least three problems:

1) A proliferation of similar credits. So we had First Assistant Director, and 1st Assistant Director, and 1st Asst Dir. Or Visual Effects Producer and VFX Producer. Or Producer and "Produced By". If folks can figure out that "Written By' is the same as Writer, they can figure out that "Produced By" is the same as Producer.

2) Very obscure credits. "Personal Assistant to Timothy Hutton" instead of "Personal Assistant" with "Timothy Hutton" in the attribute field. All for one episode of Leverage where the PA got that credit instead of just "Personal Assistant."

(Adding an attribute field at TVMaze would probably help, but I understand it's programming stuff, and it isn't a priority.)

3) Duplication. Somehow Executive Producer got in there at least twice. Doesn't sound like much, but then you had some EPs in one location for an episode among the crew, and some EPs on the same page in another location.

If for some reason his title needs to be changed at a later date then so be it

Well... no?
Based on my experience with databases, and what I've seen of TVMaze, here's what'll happen

This is a very well explanation :)

Well... no?
Based on my experience with databases, and what I've seen of TVMaze, here's what'll happen

This is a very well explanation :)

I agree. It's important to make sure that there won't be any duplicate data on our site, as that makes it a lot harder to maintain. We chose to specify the Writer credit on the episode-level, which means we shouldn't also have one on the show-level. We can simply add the credit by the time the episode is actually released, we'll survive without it in the mean time. :)

The following onscreen crew positions should perhaps be added:

Music Score (or Score)

Main Title Theme (or several variations of this such as Title Theme, Main Theme, and Theme)

Supervising Film Editor (see below)

Recording Supervisor

Based on the Film

-----

I'm still unclear, and it may be a never-ending battle. But... I'm not sure when a near-duplicate is necessary. And whether staff wants it.

For instance, should someone use Film Editor instead of Supervising Film Editor? Or should Supervising Film Editor be an option?

I understand that staff doesn't want an endless list of crew positions. Neither do I. :)

On the other hand, if a position isn't on the list, it's hard to know if an alternate should be used. And what that alternative is. Yes, if I don't see Supervising Film Editor, a year from now I could figure that "Yeah, they must not want it, use Film Editor" instead. But if I see Score at the end of an episode, I might not look under "Music Score." Or under all the variations of Main Title Theme.

Addressed to David only, as he seems to be the one handling crew credits:

On the issue of "bad credits" getting into the system mentioned earlier, I notice that Cinematographer is on the Crew list,

IMDB is

the only site that uses this (along with sites that get their info from IMDB).

For TV shows they always put "Director of Photography" afterward. There is no such TV credit as Cinematographer. Hence "Cinema" in it. :)

It's a carryover from when IMDB was movies only, and they never added the DoP TV equivalent in. Instead they rely on the accompanying attribute field to list it correctly.

The problem is... how do you find all of the incorrect applications of it, and switch them to the correct Director of Photography?

To David, according to wikipedia.com that is a trusted source more than not, it is valid to use either one for Movies or TV : Cinematographer - A cinematographer or director of photography (sometimes shortened to DP or DOP) is the chief over the camera crews working on a film, television production or other live action piece and is responsible for achieving artistic and technical decisions related to the image. The study and practice of this field is referred to as cinematography. Some filmmakers say that the cinematographer is just the chief over the camera and lighting, and the Director of Photography is the chief over all the photography components of film, including framing, costumes, makeup, and lighting, as well as the assistant of the post producer for color correction and grading.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinematographer

To David: Cinematographers work on film, Directors of Photography work in TV. Just as Wikipedia says, but it does not say the two are interchangeable. Regardless, the issue isn't whether someone anonymously posted a definition on Wikipedia. it's whether it used as an onscreen credit in television production. Even IMDb agrees that it isn't.

To take one example out of thousands:

IMDB lists the following for Gotham:

Thomas Yatsko:

Cinematographer: TV (13 credits)

- The Anvil or the Hammer (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)

- Beasts of Prey (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)

- Red Hood (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)

- The Scarecrow (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)

- Welcome Back, Jim Gordon (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)

(and eight more times)

And the onscreen credits confirm he is listed as... Director of Photography..

Find any example where it's used on TVMaze, and both IMDB and the onscreen credits will say "Director of Photography."

*shrug* I don't know how you fix it. If you replace theincorrect Cinematographer to accurately say "Director of Photography" in the database, you'd have it listed twice. I doubt if you can merge the two, although that would be ideal if you could. If you delete it... I don't know what that will do to instances where it's assigned. Ideally, someone goes in and checks each entry, deletes the incorrect one, and adds the correct DoPone. Is there a way to find all instances where a crew credit is used?

To David: Cinematographers work on film, Directors of Photography work in TV. Just as Wikipedia says, but it does not say the two are interchangeable. Regardless, the issue isn't whether someone anonymously posted a definition on Wikipedia. it's whether it used as an onscreen credit in television production. Even IMDb agrees that it isn't.
To take one example out of thousands:
IMDB lists the following for Gotham:
Thomas Yatsko:
Cinematographer: TV (13 credits)
- The Anvil or the Hammer (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)
- Beasts of Prey (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)
- Red Hood (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)
- The Scarecrow (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)
- Welcome Back, Jim Gordon (2015) ... (director of photography - as Thomas Yatsko)
(and eight more times)

And the onscreen credits confirm he is listed as... Director of Photography..
Find any example where it's used on TVMaze, and both IMDB and the onscreen credits will say "Director of Photography."
*shrug* I don't know how you fix it. If you replace theincorrect Cinematographer to accurately say "Director of Photography" in the database, you'd have it listed twice. I doubt if you can merge the two, although that would be ideal if you could. If you delete it... I don't know what that will do to instances where it's assigned. Ideally, someone goes in and checks each entry, deletes the incorrect one, and adds the correct DoPone. Is there a way to find all instances where a crew credit is used?

Would you be happy with a compromise so to speak in that the site allow both titles to be used like this Cinematographer/Director of Photography ?

I only listed Cinematographer first because it would appear first on the drop down list alphabetically, that way if they really wanted to use DOP they would find it right away as well.

Would you be happy with a compromise so to speak in that the site allow both titles to be used like this Cinematographer/Director of Photography ?

I only listed Cinematographer first because it would appear first on the drop down list alphabetically, that way if they really wanted to use DOP they would find it right away as well.

My first question would be, why do you want it there? Which on-screen TV credits have you seen listing someone as a Cinematographer? Because if it exists, fair enough, I agree that it shouldn't be removed.

But anyhoo, it's not up to me. :) That's a staff call. Although if it's listed as you mentioned, no one would ever find it because they'd have to type C to find Director of Photography.

My main concern with having Cinematographer on the list is that... as far as I can tell, it's never used in US or UK television. You can tell from my requests to add show: I watch stuff from the late 50s to the present day. Not to boast (much :) ) but in literally thousands of episodes, I've never seen it. So my guess would be that if anyone is assigned as Cinematographer at TVMaze, it's showing something that isn't a legitimate credit on the screen. I think that when it is used, it's because IMDB lists it in the odd format above.

And every show I have ever watched always has a Director of Photography credit. So if staff merges them, it seems that at the very least, DoP would have priority.

Now, maybe in Russian or Korean shows, Cinematographer is a common credit. Fair enough. But even then, it shouldn't be assigned incorrectly to American/UK shows. It seems that by it being on the list of accepted crew credits, we're saying it is a legitimate credit for US/UK shows. And... it doesn't seem to be. How you prevent incorrect usage, I have no idea.

And if I'm wrong, and somebody notices that it's suddenly missing from the list when they go to add it some Swedish show,

they can resist it and we

can always revisit it then.