Appearing as his/herself in a scripted show.

kevin87 wrote 7 years ago: 1

I know the policy says to add a person's nickname as the character and for talk shows to put their name as the character and check the him/herself box... but what should we do when an actor is on a scripted show playing but playing theirself? I've been checking the him/herself box when this happens up till now but should we really be doing that if they're playing fictionalized versions of themselves instead of actually appearing as theirself on a talk show or something? For example, usually the credits will say such-and-such appearing as him/herself but tonight on Alone Together, Pauly Shore was credited as "Pauly Shore as Pauly Shore." Another example would be Daniel Radcliffe playing a satirical version of himself on Extras years ago. They're obviously playing themselves, but it's not the 'real' them. Should we check the him/herself box or should we just have them as playing themselves as a character so it would show up as "Pauly Shore as Pauly Shore" instead of "Pauly Shore as himself"?

Gadfly wrote 7 years ago: 1

A "satirical version of himself" would still be "himself", wouldn't it? I'm not sure how you'd make the determination. For instance, Penn & Teller played themselves on the premiere episode of Deception. But was it the "real" them, or "satirical" versions of themselves?

I see what you're saying about how a "fictionalized" version of someone would be different than a talk-show/variety-show version. But I don't think the distinction is important enough to label them differently. You can always put that kind of info in the character biography.

tnt wrote 7 years ago: 1

What about cartoons? The Simpsons, for example, often feature the appearances of various celebrities "as themselves".

Gadfly wrote 7 years ago: 1

Also perhaps I'm misunderstanding and the concern is about the words used onscreen for crediting. Or the nature of the show they're appearing on. But...

How do you tell when someone is "real" and when they aren't?

For instance, Teller of the aforementioned Penn & Teller can speak. He just doesn't as part of the "performance". So when he appears on talk shows and hosts shows but pretends that he's mute, does that mean it's "really" him? Or that it's a performer performing a part?

Andrew Dice Clay back in the 90s, and a number of rappers, also come to mind. They say that their public personas are "performances".

Actors appearing on "real" shows a lot of the time are performing just as much as when they're on fiction shows. And the shows are just as much 'scripted". So it's not clear how you'd credit them to recognize this. Or how you would recognize it most of the time.

kevin87 wrote 7 years ago: 1

Gadfly wrote:
Also perhaps I'm misunderstanding and the concern is about the words used onscreen for crediting. Or the nature of the show they're appearing on. But...
How do you tell when someone is "real" and when they aren't?
For instance, Teller of the aforementioned Penn & Teller can speak. He just doesn't as part of the "performance". So when he appears on talk shows and hosts shows but pretends that he's mute, does that mean it's "really" him? Or that it's a performer performing a part?
Andrew Dice Clay back in the 90s, and a number of rappers, also come to mind. They say that their public personas are "performances".
Actors appearing on "real" shows a lot of the time are performing just as much as when they're on fiction shows. And the shows are just as much 'scripted". So it's not clear how you'd credit them to recognize this. Or how you would recognize it most of the time.

Maybe I'd just be over simplifying it but I'd personally say if they're on a scripted show, they're basically playing a character of themselves and reading from a script or acting like an exaggerated version for acting purposes so maybe that's when the box shouldn't be checked. Talk shows/reality/documentary etc etc would be more of a him/herself situation. I just thought about the differences because in this particular instance the credits said "Pauly Shore as Pauly Shore" instead of "Paul Shore as himself."

tnt wrote 7 years ago: 1

Do musicians on the stage acting as themselves? Stand-up comedians? Talk show hosts? Drag queens?

IMO there's no need to overthink. In general I think it's safe to presume that "as themselves" equals "credited as themselves or appears under their own birth or stage name."

tnt wrote 7 years ago: 1

In the light of said above it's somehow weird to see this:

https://www.tvmaze.com/search/characters?show_id=2174&q=himself

JuanArango wrote 7 years ago: 1

tnt wrote:
In the light of said above it's somehow weird to see this:
https://www.tvmaze.com/search/characters?show_id=2174&q=himself

Yes, but I think we have to live with it :)

tnt wrote 7 years ago: 1

JuanArango wrote:
Yes, but I think we have to live with it :)

Any reason why?

MTQueenie wrote 7 years ago: 1

JuanArango wrote:
Yes, but I think we have to live with it :)

Why? as far as i can see those are added incorrectly. When adding someone as themselves we have always used their name and then ticked the him/herself box, we don't use himself as a character name because then this happens. So unless there's been a change in the way we add these that I'm not aware off these needs to be corrected?

JuanArango wrote 7 years ago: 1

MTQueenie wrote:
Why? as far as i can see those are added incorrectly. When adding someone as themselves we have always used their name and then ticked the him/herself box, we don't use himself as a character name because then this happens. So unless there's been a change in the way we add these that I'm not aware off these needs to be corrected?

Oh you are correct :)

MTQueenie wrote 7 years ago: 1

JuanArango wrote:
Oh you are correct :)

Good, we agree then ;) They are fixed now

tnt wrote 7 years ago: 1

MTQueenie wrote:
Good, we agree then ;) They are fixed now

Thank you for doing this while I was busy with the second season :)